Interview with Sally Sara on ABC RN Breakfast

SENATOR ANDREW BRAGG

Shadow Minister for Productivity and Deregulation

Shadow Minister for Housing and Homelessness

Liberal Senator for New South Wales

TRANSCRIPT

INTERVIEW WITH SALLY SARA ON ABC RN BREAKFAST

25 August 2025

Subjects: Five per cent home deposit scheme, Changes to approvals under the EPBC Act, Changes to the National Construction Code.

E&OE………

Sally Sara

Andrew Bragg is the Shadow Minister for Housing and also the Shadow Minister for Productivity and Deregulation, and joins me now. Andrew Bragg, welcome back to Breakfast.

Senator Bragg

Good morning, Sally.

Sally Sara

We heard the Prime Minister earlier saying that the expansion of the First Home Buyers Guarantee will make an enormous difference. In your view, is it a step in the right direction?

Senator Bragg

Well, Sally, as you know, these demands side measures can be okay, but the main point about housing is to get the houses built. It's a supply side challenge. Now, the government has presided over the biggest population surge since the '50s with a, also, massive collapse in housing construction, so this is an absolute mess. These demand side measures can help on the margins, but the main game here is supply.

Sally Sara

Is this also about equity here, so that more first home buyers can get into the market because structurally, that's a big problem...

Senator Bragg

Equity for who? This is an uncapped scheme which is available to billionaires, or the children of billionaires, if they want to use a government program. And I think we're getting to a point where Australia is becoming a ridiculous nation where the taxpayer is under-writing mortgage insurance schemes for extremely wealthy people. I think it's bizarre and ridiculous.

Sally Sara

Do you think that it should be restricted?

Senator Bragg

Yes.

Sally Sara

To who?

Senator Bragg

Well, I mean, the starting point is that we haven't seen the legislative instrument from the government. We haven't seen the detail. They've had a secret consultation with the industry about this. This is going to disrupt the fintech and disruptive sectors that have created products where people have no or low deposits, Sally. The government don't care about these businesses because they would rather have a big government solution to every problem. This is just another example of the government's increasing red tape burden across the economy and particularly in the housing sector. Now you're going to have the Commonwealth Government become the major supplier of mortgage insurance and become a property developer, at the same time, they're saying they want to cut red tape. I mean, it's laughable.

Sally Sara

Do you welcome the pause to the National Construction Code with exemptions for safety changes?

Senator Bragg

Well, this was our policy for the last election in the main, and Labor said it was a terrible idea...

Sally Sara

But you didn't have the safety changes protected, correct?

Senator Bragg

Well, we haven't seen the changes.

Sally Sara

What do you mean?

Senator Bragg

Well, the government puts out press releases at 10:30 on Saturday night, but we don't see the detail of what they're proposing to do to the NCC. In fact, that's subject to a meeting the Minister would have to chair with the State colleagues, and then the States would have to legislate the changes. So, this idea that there's going to be any instantaneous improvement to housing here, again, is laughable.

Sally Sara

The government says that it can streamline environmental approvals to build thousands of new homes. It says they will incentivise developers to provide required information upfront. Do you think that will make a difference?

Senator Bragg

That would be a great idea. And that was a policy we had at the last election. We very much welcome anything in that area because the EPBC Act has been administered by this Labor Government in a way which has been very anti-housing development. In fact, just because a bird flew over a housing lot in 1971 shouldn't mean we can't have houses built today. That's frankly what's happening now.

Sally Sara

What else should governments be looking at to detangle regulation and speed up approvals at the State and at the Federal level?

Senator Bragg

Well, I mean, the Commonwealth can't fix what the States are doing and they've got to play in their own domain. I think the main game here is listening to builders, tradies, and developers about what's holding back the new housing supply that the nation needs. A lot of that goes to cost, a lot of that goes to the ongoing regulatory burden. I mean, these are the main things, but it's also recognising the role of the state. I mean, the government's got a $10 billion housing scheme that's built 17 houses in two years. The government needs to actually let the private sector build the houses, not try and do it themselves.

Sally Sara

You're listening to Radio National Breakfast, and you're hearing from the Shadow Minister for Housing and Homelessness, and, also the Shadow Minister for Productivity and Deregulation, Andrew Bragg. There's currently no means testing for the Home Buyers Guarantee, but there is a cap on the price of the house that you can buy with it. Is it realistic to say that children of billionaires are really going to use it?

Senator Bragg

Well, they're proposing that there be no income cap.

Sally Sara

But there's a cap on the price of housing.

Senator Bragg

Yeah, but there's no income cap. Why should extremely wealthy people get access to a government insurance scheme? It just seems bizarre to me. I can't see the case for it. Can you?

Sally Sara

On the National Construction Code, you proposed a 10 year freeze to new regulation in the last election campaign. The government's only pausing updates until 2029. Is that a more sensible time frame? How do you see the time frame?

Senator Bragg

We thought that the 10 year freeze was a good idea because it would give industry time to adapt to the 2022 changes, which many people say are very complex. Effectively, the government now is offering a one year freeze from 2028 to 2029. We welcome anything that's going to be sensible, but we thought that the 10 year freeze was going to make a big difference. But let's see where they get to with these Ministers meetings they need to do with the States because my sense is it will take some time to get any material changes through - because as I say, it needs to be legislated; the National Construction Code is legislated by the States at their own level.

Sally Sara

Andrew Bragg, thank you for your time this morning.

Senator Bragg

Thanks, Sally. Thanks a lot.

[Ends]