Interview with Sylvia Jeffreys on the Today Show

SENATOR ANDREW BRAGG

Shadow Minister for Productivity and Deregulation

Shadow Minister for Housing and Homelessness

Liberal Senator for New South Wales

TRANSCRIPT

INTERVIEW WITH SYLVIA JEFFREYS ON THE TODAY SHOW

12 December 2025

Subjects: Anthony Albanese’s refusal to examine travel entitlements, social media ban, AI and Time’s Person of the Year

E&OE………

Sylvia Jeffreys

Welcome back. After a week of fierce debate and criticism over politicians' expenses, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese is refusing to make any changes to entitlements, declaring he is not the Finance Minister. Joining us to discuss today's headlines is Liberal Senator Andrew Bragg in Sydney and Independent MP Allegra Spender, also in Sydney. Morning to you both. Allegra, I'll come to you first. The Prime Minister has been dubbed the ‘artful dodger’ for avoiding questions over the issue this week. Does he have something to answer for?

Allegra Spender

Look, I think that community expectations are basically saying – ‘Hey, this isn't quite in line with what we think.’ I was at the ferry the other day doing a pop-up office, and a guy came up to me and said – ‘Look, it just doesn't pass the pub test. You guys need to rein this in.’ And I think that the Prime Minister should bring forward one of the reviews that they've pushed back. And I think it's reasonable. Look at these rules again and put some more caps or approaches in there which I think are more in line with community expectations.

Sylvia Jeffreys

You're right to point that out because the AFR reveals this morning that the Albanese Government has twice now delayed a review of the travel rules and entitlements. It'll be overdue by the time we get around to it, potentially at this stage in 2027. Andrew, would you welcome a review?

Senator Bragg

Well, this is the most powerful Prime Minister we've had in decades, and I think Australians are starting to see this guy for who he is. He is a dodger, and he's covering up all this stuff. So, I mean, he could fix this if he wanted to, and it's now becoming a massive integrity issue. But as he said yesterday, he is trying to evade it, but he could actually fix it if he wanted to.

Sylvia Jeffreys

So, would you welcome a review, personally?

Senator Bragg

Of course. I mean, as I say, he's a very powerful Prime Minister. He's got massive power. And I think people are starting to see him for who he is. He's very weak, and he's covering up this massive integrity issue. He could fix this.

Sylvia Jeffreys

Do you know what really stands out to me this morning, Allegra, is that after all that's been said and asked and answered or not answered this week, we still don't know why it cost taxpayers $100,000 for three people to fly to New York.

Allegra Spender

Look, I think that's a question myself and my husband were sitting there on the phone at night, trying to work out how you could spend that much money on a flight. But I think the point actually that I've noticed coming into politics, having been in business, particularly small business, is that I think the scrutiny and the sort of sense that, you know, when you're in business, you're often looking for the best deal. You know, saying – ‘Well, that's really expensive, I can't justify that. Can I get a slightly later flight?’ or those things. Now, I think we could do much better at that in politics in terms of trying to get better deals in terms of costs. And I think that is part of what is going on here. Because, you know, politics is really hard on families. You know, I'm lucky I live in Sydney, it's closer than most, but it is really hard on all families. So I think there's a space for things like family reunion, but people want to make sure that you're getting value for money and that you're not taking the piss. And I think this is where better scrutiny, but also being a bit tougher in terms of getting the best fares…

Sylvia Jeffreys

It’s just common sense.

Allegra Spender

I think is a cultural change we could all do with.

Sylvia Jeffreys

That's right. The public's just asking for a little bit of restraint. I think it's quite simple. Moving on, Australia's social media ban for under 16’s has caught the eye of Prince Harry and Meghan Markle. Andrew, they've praised the move saying – ‘We celebrate Australia's leadership for seeing and acting on how these technology companies are negatively impacting young people with little to no recourse or accountability.’ What do you make of their endorsement?

Senator Bragg

Well, we're not going to take policy advice from these Americans. I mean, it's very funny, I think. I mean, effectively what we started out with was a trial to stop a couple of social media sites not be used by under 16’s. Now it's expanded into things like YouTube being banned. I mean, it's starting to feel like a Chinese-style firewall on the internet in Australia. So, I think we've got to be restrained. And as I say, we won't be taking any policy advice from these Americans.

Sylvia Jeffreys

Allegra, what do you make of that? You know, we're only a couple of days in. How confident are you that it will work?

Allegra Spender

Look, I don't know exactly how well it will work, but I think what I'm hearing a lot from families is that it's resetting the conversation. And I think that's what a lot of people want. But I do think we need to go further in terms of addressing social media harms. And one of the areas that I'm really backing at the moment is ‘Fix Our Feeds,’ which is led by Chanel Contos and others, which is really about saying, look, how can you also turn off the algorithms? Because it's not just kids who are struggling with social media content. It's also adults really being served a whole bunch of content that they really don't want and is really making a problem. So, I think we need to look at other areas like fixing the algorithms or a duty of care from social media because this ban won't be perfect. I think we know that.

Sylvia Jeffreys

Okay, well speaking of tech bros, Time's Person of the Year has been announced. And it's not one person, it's a bunch of people. Andrew, it's been awarded to the architects of AI. Your thoughts?

Senator Bragg

Well, I mean, it's a nice idea, but I think Australia is going to miss out on a lot of the benefits because of Labor's red tape. I mean, they've got 5,000 new regulations. They've got their Future Made in Australia. They've got so much regulation and now the prospect of more taxes that we actually might miss the boat on a lot of the benefits here. So, AI is great, but I'm worried that we're going to miss the boat.

Sylvia Jeffreys

Personally, Allegra, I'd like to nominate Mitch Starc or maybe even Steve Smith. What do you think?

Allegra Spender

Well, we've still got a few more to go, but hey, I think they're doing pretty well, I have to say. Look, it's interesting. I think Time's Person of the Year has not always been a popularity contest. I think it has also been about people changing the world. And it's fair to say that AI is changing the world, and I think will change the world. I think the question really is how to make sure that it changes the world both for better in Australia, but also that we manage, again, the sort of challenges that will come with it.

Sylvia Jeffreys

Yeah, for better or worse, they are the people of the year. Allegra and Andrew, thanks for your time today. We appreciate it. See you soon.

[Ends]

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