Interview with Clinton Maynard on 2GB Drive

‍Subjects: NCC, Housing and Migration, Multiculturalism

E&OE......... 

Clinton Maynard:

The opposition today has stepped up their campaign to reduce migration. The Shadow Housing Minister Andrew Bragg has addressed the National Press Club, and he actually has put some numbers on what the opposition, if they win the election, would aim to bring migration down to. He joins me on the program. Hi Andrew.

Senator Bragg:

Hi Clinton, how are you?

Clinton Maynard:

I'm good. Look, well done firstly for actually putting a number on this. You are suggesting that the net migration rate should be lowered to around 180,000.

Senator Bragg:

Well, effectively the problem we have is that we've had too many people come into the country relative to the houses built. So because of that, we have a gap of about 350 to 400,000 places that are needed to house people, okay? That's places, not houses. And so if you want to close that, then you need to have a net overseas migration number somewhere around 180,000, yes. So that's—that's sort of the parameters we're having to work with. And if you had it at 180,000 for the next few years, you would close the gap.

Clinton Maynard:

It's currently around 300,000. Now, there have been promises that's been made by the current government to reduce the number, and consistently over the past few years they've failed to meet that. What gives voters any confidence given that—and yes, it's not your side of politics, but no doubt there are bureaucrats that provide the estimates—given the government at the moment has missed those targets, how can you reach those targets?

Senator Bragg:

Well, because we have said that there is a nexus between home building and migration that I don't think the government even accept is a thing. So we would say that you need to consider the number of houses you build and then you can consider your migration program in that order. And so this is a new thing in Australia. I mean, we should have had it many years ago, but I mean, as you know Clinton, I mean, the—the country's sort of been run on autopilot, which is why it's been run so poorly. And so I'm confident that if we do—do the modelling and do this properly, we could actually house more Australians and also house the new Australians who are coming in.

Clinton Maynard:

And we're going to need them to build the houses. Where would—where do you believe at this early stage, where do you believe you could make the reductions?

Senator Bragg:

Well, that's something that we really need to work through carefully with the industry because we—we—for example, we know that we need more tradies, foreign tradies to come in to supplement the Australian born tradies. And as I said today at the press club, I mean, I question whether we need all the baristas and the pastry chefs that are coming in at the moment under different visas. So that's something that we need to work through carefully. The point of today's exercise was to show, look, this is the gap, it's 350 to 400,000, and this is the sort of net overseas migration number, 180,000, that you'd need to have if you wanted to close the gap over a few years.

Clinton Maynard:

There was a story this week about international students and family members being granted visas as well. Is that an area you'd look at?

Senator Bragg:

Well, I think you need to look at the overall migration program and make sure that you're getting bang for buck. And I think the country deserves to treat this as a strategic endeavor, and make sure that we're getting the best possible people that we can get that are going to make a contribution and—and kind of love Australia as much as we do.

Clinton Maynard:

Pauline Hanson and One Nation, they're promising to reduce it even further downwards towards 130,000. Is that possible?

Senator Bragg:

Well, I'm not sure that's desirable. I mean, it's—it's—it's lower than the range that we believe would be necessary, and I think you've got to be careful that you don't—I mean, this—this is a difficult undertaking because you've got to balance a lot of different competing objectives. For example, you need temporary workers in different parts of the country, for example fruit picking, there's all sorts of different skill shortages which can emerge at any time. So that's—that's why I was careful to say, look, this is the sort of range that we need to be in.

Clinton Maynard:

Do you think that—and I'm with Andrew Bragg, the Shadow Housing Minister—do you think that Pauline Hanson's One Nation has the ability to—to set policy and run the country?

Senator Bragg:

Well, I don't think so, because a lot of the things that are said don't make a lot of sense in terms of their Budget policies and their economic policies. Also, I mean, even just the idea of this monoculture I think is very weird. I mean, there were Jewish people on the First Fleet. By—by definition we've been multicultural since 1788. So a lot of it I think is not a particularly serious contribution to the debate. But look, I welcome the competition, and I think the competition is sort of saying to us, look, we don't think the two-party system has been as good as it should have been. I think our response to that should be, well, we're going to do better.

Clinton Maynard:

If after—and we all know the Labor Party's on the nose, the Prime Minister's on the nose—if after the next election, and I'm not suggesting you're going to enter into a formal coalition with One Nation, I know you're not going to agree to that here, but if after the next election you are negotiating with a crossbench, and the crossbench is dominated by One Nation or maybe it's the other way around, how do you come up with a policy on migration when they want to go 130, you want to go 180, what do you come up with, a compromise and have 150?

Senator Bragg:

Well, I mean, as you know, it's a very big hypothetical. I mean, we don't know where all the votes will—will be, but the objective right now is to get rid of this terrible socialist government. I think that's very important for our country because we're going backwards, we're going down the gurgler with their—their crazy tax policies, all their regulation, all their terrible anti-productivity measures that's all about shoveling cash to the unions. So that's our number one priority.

Clinton Maynard:

Well, good on you for actually putting numbers on this today because I think a lot of Australians who are searching for answers wanted to hear that today. Thank you Andrew.

Senator Bragg:

Thanks Clinton. See you. Cheers.

Clinton Maynard:

The opposition's housing spokesperson, Senator Andrew Bragg.